BMG Music Service releases

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BMG Music Service releases

David Gasaway
Hello all,

I'd like to get some additional opinions on the following edit regarding releases obtained through BMG Music Service.

http://musicbrainz.org/edit/21053729

Specifically, this edit is about artwork, but has implications for releases, cat#, barcodes, etc.  Thanks.

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Re: BMG Music Service releases

Nicolás Tamargo de Eguren


On Fri, Feb 22, 2013 at 9:07 PM, David Gasaway <[hidden email]> wrote:
Hello all,

I'd like to get some additional opinions on the following edit regarding releases obtained through BMG Music Service.

http://musicbrainz.org/edit/21053729

Specifically, this edit is about artwork, but has implications for releases, cat#, barcodes, etc.  Thanks.

Different cat# and barcode is always a different release. You can reuse the tracklist and recordings though, of course :)

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Re: BMG Music Service releases

David Gasaway


On Fri, Feb 22, 2013 at 8:05 PM, Nicolás Tamargo de Eguren <[hidden email]> wrote:
 
Different cat# and barcode is always a different release. You can reuse the tracklist and recordings though, of course :)


There is no new barcode, just a new cat#.  And you can (as I'm sure you know) put two label+cat# on a single release.  In fact, the new release that ListMyCDs added has both.

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Re: BMG Music Service releases

jacobbrett
David Gasaway wrote
On Fri, Feb 22, 2013 at 8:05 PM, Nicolás Tamargo de Eguren <
[hidden email]> wrote:


> Different cat# and barcode is always a different release. You can reuse
> the tracklist and recordings though, of course :)
>
>
There is no new barcode, just a new cat#.  And you can (as I'm sure you
know) put two label+cat# on a single release.  In fact, the new release
that ListMyCDs added has both.

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If the packaging is marked differently, it's probably a different release (a different catalogue number is always a different MB release (and even as the label is concerned, as they consciously differentiated it).
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Re: BMG Music Service releases

Nicolás Tamargo de Eguren
In reply to this post by David Gasaway


On Sat, Feb 23, 2013 at 9:30 AM, David Gasaway <[hidden email]> wrote:


On Fri, Feb 22, 2013 at 8:05 PM, Nicolás Tamargo de Eguren <[hidden email]> wrote:
 
Different cat# and barcode is always a different release. You can reuse the tracklist and recordings though, of course :)


There is no new barcode, just a new cat#.  And you can (as I'm sure you know) put two label+cat# on a single release.  In fact, the new release that ListMyCDs added has both.

You can, of course, but the point is that they can have two cat#s if they're both on *the same release*. People who don't have the BMG one won't have the BMG cat#, which means they're different releases.

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Re: BMG Music Service releases

David Gasaway
In reply to this post by jacobbrett
On Sat, Feb 23, 2013 at 4:01 AM, jacobbrett <[hidden email]> wrote:

If the packaging is marked differently, it's probably a different release (a
different catalogue number is always a different MB release (and even as the
label is concerned, as they consciously differentiated it).

I'm not sure you understand the context here.  These are releases from BMG Music Service, which was basically a wholesale reseller, not a label in the traditional sense.
 
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Re: BMG Music Service releases

David Gasaway
In reply to this post by Nicolás Tamargo de Eguren

On Sat, Feb 23, 2013 at 4:55 AM, Nicolás Tamargo de Eguren <[hidden email]> wrote:

You can, of course, but the point is that they can have two cat#s if they're both on *the same release*.

I see.  I don't believe I've ever seen that explained anywhere.

 
People who don't have the BMG one won't have the BMG cat#, which means they're different releases.


I'm not sure why that's the necessary conclusion in this case.  Perhaps it's because I do not view BMG Music Service has a proper label but everyone else does.  For me, it would be like creating a new MBz release for every Amazon MP3 Store release because Amazon puts an ASIN tag in all their files.

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Re: BMG Music Service releases

Nicolás Tamargo de Eguren


On Sun, Feb 24, 2013 at 3:03 AM, David Gasaway <[hidden email]> wrote:

On Sat, Feb 23, 2013 at 4:55 AM, Nicolás Tamargo de Eguren <[hidden email]> wrote:

You can, of course, but the point is that they can have two cat#s if they're both on *the same release*.

I see.  I don't believe I've ever seen that explained anywhere.

 
People who don't have the BMG one won't have the BMG cat#, which means they're different releases.


I'm not sure why that's the necessary conclusion in this case.  Perhaps it's because I do not view BMG Music Service has a proper label but everyone else does.  For me, it would be like creating a new MBz release for every Amazon MP3 Store release because Amazon puts an ASIN tag in all their files.

I don't particularly view it as a proper label, but they do make very visible changes to packaging, and add a specific catalog number [1]. That BMG catalog number is *not* present in the general release of the albums, so adding it to that release would be misleading (well, more than misleading, it would be simply wrong, really) and cause confusion with people who have the original release and would assume this was something else.

Adding a new version of a release is pretty simple - if you add it from the sidebar of the release group page, the title and artist fields will be pre-filled, a fair amount of the rest of the fields in the first page of the release editor will be different anyway, and the rest of the tabs don't have to be filled since you can reuse the tracklist for the original version of the release. So adding these as new releases doesn't even take that long.

[1] I'm not sure if a new cat# is *always* present (it is in the examples I've seen) but a different legal text would already be enough for it to qualify as a separate release anyway, and I'm reasonably sure they all have the "for BMG Direct" thingy.
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Re: BMG Music Service releases

David Gasaway
On Sat, Feb 23, 2013 at 5:20 PM, Nicolás Tamargo de Eguren <[hidden email]> wrote:
 
Adding a new version of a release is pretty simple - if you add it from the sidebar of the release group page, the title and artist fields will be pre-filled, a fair amount of the rest of the fields in the first page of the release editor will be different anyway, and the rest of the tabs don't have to be filled since you can reuse the tracklist for the original version of the release. So adding these as new releases doesn't even take that long.

As I said in the edit: that's only the case if I blindly accept the existing data.  It's a rare case that I come across a classical release that meets OLD CSG, let alone NGS and all the new classical style.  And I'm not going to be happy entering a new release that isn't up to snuff.  I don't say that to influence anyone's decision, by the way.  I'm just providing some insight to the challenges that editors face.
 
[1] I'm not sure if a new cat# is *always* present (it is in the examples I've seen) but a different legal text would already be enough for it to qualify as a separate release anyway, and I'm reasonably sure they all have the "for BMG Direct" thingy.

If there are any that don't, it's pretty rare, judging from my collection.


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