DVD audio rips: official or bootleg?

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DVD audio rips: official or bootleg?

lixobix
I'm talking about releases that are the entire audio track extracted from a (usually musical) DVD. Should these be added as bootlegs (digital media, no label etc), or as official (DVD / DVD Audio, + release info as per the DVD)? Technically, the audio has been officially released, as the audio track is on the DVD, but these feel more like bootlegs by the time they are on a computer / burned to CD.

Thoughts?
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Re: DVD audio rips: official or bootleg?

Nicolás Tamargo de Eguren
On Sat, Oct 4, 2014 at 2:52 PM, lixobix <[hidden email]> wrote:
I'm talking about releases that are the entire audio track extracted from a
(usually musical) DVD. Should these be added as bootlegs (digital media, no
label etc), or as official (DVD / DVD Audio, + release info as per the DVD)?
Technically, the audio has been officially released, as the audio track is
on the DVD, but these feel more like bootlegs by the time they are on a
computer / burned to CD.

Well the DVD should be added as a DVD - as per the bootleg, dunno, you wouldn't add a separate release for a CD rip, I imagine, so why for this? 

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Re: DVD audio rips: official or bootleg?

lixobix
Nicolás Tamargo de Eguren wrote
On Sat, Oct 4, 2014 at 2:52 PM, lixobix <[hidden email]> wrote:

> I'm talking about releases that are the entire audio track extracted from a
> (usually musical) DVD. Should these be added as bootlegs (digital media, no
> label etc), or as official (DVD / DVD Audio, + release info as per the
> DVD)?
> Technically, the audio has been officially released, as the audio track is
> on the DVD, but these feel more like bootlegs by the time they are on a
> computer / burned to CD.


Well the DVD should be added as a DVD - as per the bootleg, dunno, you
wouldn't add a separate release for a CD rip, I imagine, so why for this?

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For one, I'm still unclear what the rules for adding DVDs are. For example, should the tracklist correspond to the chapter breaks, or the tracks played, interviews etc, regardless of chapter breaks? This may not be an issue with most releases, but it could affect how a DVD is added.

Secondly, when the audio is extracted it is usually as a single stream, which may then be broken up into tracks that do not correspond to the divisions of the DVD itself. There may be different ways of doing so, resulting in different tracklists. Surely these could not all be added as the official DVD release, even though they amount to the same audio stream.

Third, certain parts of the audio stream may be removed, such as talking in between the music. I presume these would be added as bootlegs, as they don't correspond to the full audio stream. I'm thinking particularly of 'unofficial' movie soundtracks that were never released on their own, but have been constructed from other sources or extracted from the DVD audio:

http://musicbrainz.org/release/854d1de4-f1aa-4981-aa8f-09d57c85825a
http://musicbrainz.org/release/1cb11f92-451a-434d-ac0b-cec7fc54d4d5

I don't think either of these could be said to be officially released, as soundtracks as opposed to the films themselves. The latter ('Her') did stream online for a while, I'm not sure whether we classify that as a release yet. It's certainly not available in an official form at the moment.
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Re: DVD audio rips: official or bootleg?

Cheezmo
I have added a lot of DVD-Audio releases (and several CD+DVD releases).  In my opinion the track lengths should match the chapter lengths on the DVD.  The track order should reflect what is on the cover and/or what is reflected on the DVD menus (hopefully they are the same, but not always so some judgement has to be used sometimes).  If there is a chapter break/chapter that doesn't exist on the cover as is common with "End Titles" on music video compilations, etc. I do include that as what is on the medium should be reflected.

If someone ripped a live CD and edited out the banter, you wouldn't add that edited version to MusicBrainz, you would reflect what is on the CD so DVD's should be done the same.


On Oct 5, 2014, at 4:05 AM, lixobix <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Nicolás Tamargo de Eguren wrote
>> On Sat, Oct 4, 2014 at 2:52 PM, lixobix &lt;
>
>> arjtaplin@
>
>> &gt; wrote:
>>
>>> I'm talking about releases that are the entire audio track extracted from
>>> a
>>> (usually musical) DVD. Should these be added as bootlegs (digital media,
>>> no
>>> label etc), or as official (DVD / DVD Audio, + release info as per the
>>> DVD)?
>>> Technically, the audio has been officially released, as the audio track
>>> is
>>> on the DVD, but these feel more like bootlegs by the time they are on a
>>> computer / burned to CD.
>>
>>
>> Well the DVD should be added as a DVD - as per the bootleg, dunno, you
>> wouldn't add a separate release for a CD rip, I imagine, so why for this?
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> MusicBrainz-users mailing list
>
>> MusicBrainz-users@.musicbrainz
>
>> http://lists.musicbrainz.org/mailman/listinfo/musicbrainz-users
>
> For one, I'm still unclear what the rules for adding DVDs are. For example,
> should the tracklist correspond to the chapter breaks, or the tracks played,
> interviews etc, regardless of chapter breaks? This may not be an issue with
> most releases, but it could affect how a DVD is added.
>
> Secondly, when the audio is extracted it is usually as a single stream,
> which may then be broken up into tracks that do not correspond to the
> divisions of the DVD itself. There may be different ways of doing so,
> resulting in different tracklists. Surely these could not all be added as
> the official DVD release, even though they amount to the same audio stream.
>
> Third, certain parts of the audio stream may be removed, such as talking in
> between the music. I presume these would be added as bootlegs, as they don't
> correspond to the full audio stream. I'm thinking particularly of
> 'unofficial' movie soundtracks that were never released on their own, but
> have been constructed from other sources or extracted from the DVD audio:
>
> http://musicbrainz.org/release/854d1de4-f1aa-4981-aa8f-09d57c85825a
> http://musicbrainz.org/release/1cb11f92-451a-434d-ac0b-cec7fc54d4d5
>
> I don't think either of these could be said to be officially released, as
> soundtracks as opposed to the films themselves. The latter ('Her') did
> stream online for a while, I'm not sure whether we classify that as a
> release yet. It's certainly not available in an official form at the moment.
>
>
>
> --
> View this message in context: http://musicbrainz.1054305.n4.nabble.com/DVD-audio-rips-official-or-bootleg-tp4668618p4668632.html
> Sent from the MusicBrainz - Users mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
>
> _______________________________________________
> MusicBrainz-users mailing list
> [hidden email]
> http://lists.musicbrainz.org/mailman/listinfo/musicbrainz-users


--
Steve Martin




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Re: DVD audio rips: official or bootleg?

lixobix
Cheezmo wrote
I have added a lot of DVD-Audio releases (and several CD+DVD releases).  In my opinion the track lengths should match the chapter lengths on the DVD.  The track order should reflect what is on the cover and/or what is reflected on the DVD menus (hopefully they are the same, but not always so some judgement has to be used sometimes).  If there is a chapter break/chapter that doesn't exist on the cover as is common with "End Titles" on music video compilations, etc. I do include that as what is on the medium should be reflected.

If someone ripped a live CD and edited out the banter, you wouldn't add that edited version to MusicBrainz, you would reflect what is on the CD so DVD's should be done the same.


On Oct 5, 2014, at 4:05 AM, lixobix <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Nicolás Tamargo de Eguren wrote
>> On Sat, Oct 4, 2014 at 2:52 PM, lixobix <
>
>> arjtaplin@
>
>> > wrote:
>>
>>> I'm talking about releases that are the entire audio track extracted from
>>> a
>>> (usually musical) DVD. Should these be added as bootlegs (digital media,
>>> no
>>> label etc), or as official (DVD / DVD Audio, + release info as per the
>>> DVD)?
>>> Technically, the audio has been officially released, as the audio track
>>> is
>>> on the DVD, but these feel more like bootlegs by the time they are on a
>>> computer / burned to CD.
>>
>>
>> Well the DVD should be added as a DVD - as per the bootleg, dunno, you
>> wouldn't add a separate release for a CD rip, I imagine, so why for this?
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> MusicBrainz-users mailing list
>
>> MusicBrainz-users@.musicbrainz
>
>> http://lists.musicbrainz.org/mailman/listinfo/musicbrainz-users
>
> For one, I'm still unclear what the rules for adding DVDs are. For example,
> should the tracklist correspond to the chapter breaks, or the tracks played,
> interviews etc, regardless of chapter breaks? This may not be an issue with
> most releases, but it could affect how a DVD is added.
>
> Secondly, when the audio is extracted it is usually as a single stream,
> which may then be broken up into tracks that do not correspond to the
> divisions of the DVD itself. There may be different ways of doing so,
> resulting in different tracklists. Surely these could not all be added as
> the official DVD release, even though they amount to the same audio stream.
>
> Third, certain parts of the audio stream may be removed, such as talking in
> between the music. I presume these would be added as bootlegs, as they don't
> correspond to the full audio stream. I'm thinking particularly of
> 'unofficial' movie soundtracks that were never released on their own, but
> have been constructed from other sources or extracted from the DVD audio:
>
> http://musicbrainz.org/release/854d1de4-f1aa-4981-aa8f-09d57c85825a
> http://musicbrainz.org/release/1cb11f92-451a-434d-ac0b-cec7fc54d4d5
>
> I don't think either of these could be said to be officially released, as
> soundtracks as opposed to the films themselves. The latter ('Her') did
> stream online for a while, I'm not sure whether we classify that as a
> release yet. It's certainly not available in an official form at the moment.
>
>
>
> --
> View this message in context: http://musicbrainz.1054305.n4.nabble.com/DVD-audio-rips-official-or-bootleg-tp4668618p4668632.html
> Sent from the MusicBrainz - Users mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
>
> _______________________________________________
> MusicBrainz-users mailing list
> [hidden email]
> http://lists.musicbrainz.org/mailman/listinfo/musicbrainz-users


--
Steve Martin




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MusicBrainz-users mailing list
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I agree with you on adding full DVD releases, but what about unofficial movie soundtracks? They may source audio from the DVD, but it would be ridiculous to add the entire DVD chapter list and timings. What users might have and want to tag is the selection of audio tracks they have, not a representation of the entire movie. For example:

http://musicbrainz.org/release/06a83efc-25a9-4d88-8913-10b0f6c8d7ae

This release contains a number of tracks widely circulating, as most are unavailable elsewhere. I would say it is established enough to be a release (although there may be several variations). The source of the audio is unclear, but may be from the DVD. Are you suggesting that this should not be added?